Hired help

[Rossi fan]

Hi all,

I have to have further surgery on my back shortly and will not be able to operate the rounds on my own whilst I am recouperating. (up to 3 months). I have found this retired man who will drive my van and either do the rounds for me, or my preferred option is for me to go with him.

I contacted my insurance company, Simply Business to find out about liabilities etc. They told me that I need employer liablity cover if he is doing any work on my behalf. Apparrently, if he were to get injured, he could claim against me for a large amount. Similarly, my public liability is void if I dont have employee liability for anyone working for me, even on a casual basis.

I have also found out that I could not get a self employed person to do the work for me unless they were a financial partner. If I were to take on a self employed person, I would still have to treat them as an employee. I was told that if I did not set him up as an employee, I would face a £1000,00 per day fine for not following the rules.

Just a thought if you are using someone else to do a round for you.

Paul

[Vendingwarehouse]

Paul who told you that if you have a self employed person working for you , that they have to be a financial partner. That's no right. If someone was your financial partner then yes they would be self employed, but if they are self employed, that doesn't mean they have to be your financial partner. The essence of a self employed person is that they just take care of their own tax and insurance contributions. it's especially useful for what you actually need, a short term solution. Yes you do have to treat them as an employee, but they take care of their own contributions.

[Rossi fan]

Hi Noel,

HMRC told me. I asked for clarification several times.
I was told that if I ask the help of anyone, self employed, retired or family, I still have to register them as an employee. This is their number if you want to check- please let me know if you get a different answer.
0845 60 70 143

I have just phoned again to confirm what was said. As the person I use will be driving my vehicle and using my tools and equipment, he or she has to be employed status. If they had their own van, were registered self employed and used their own equipment, then I could possibly just pay them and let them sort out their own dues and demands. She said also, if the person I used did not pay their tax and ni, I would have to pay it, if they were found out. She suggested that I use the employer status tool on their site and this has confirmed that the person would have to be employed.

Thanks,

Paul

[Vendingwarehouse]

She's right but she's leaving out some parts to scare you into registering them as an employee. When you take some one on as self employed, there is a form you have to get them to fill in, I'm not sure of the number of it. When they fill this in , you send it back to HMRC and this absolves you of any liability for their contributions. If you don't fill this in , then the person is deemed to be an employee of yours and you are responsible. And lets face it, why would you say whose van it was. If neccessary you could hire it to the guy for £1 per day.

[Rossi fan]

Hi Noel,

To be honest, I am going to have enough to worry about and deal with after the op, so I dont want anything else on my mind, like, am I taking any uneccessary risks. If I were asking someone in this trade to keep my vendors going whilst I was getting better, that I am sure would be fine, but anyone outside of family is a risk too far, unless it is set up with proper insurance and legal as far as employment law stands.

Thanks for your advice.

Paul

[Vendingwarehouse]

I see your point Paul, you have enough to deal with. I hope the op goes ok for you mate.

[Rossi fan]

Hi Noel,

Yes it is quite a big op. Spinal deccompression, with instrumented fusion of the vertebra.

I am in a significant amount of pain at the moment and the consultant has said that this will stabilise my lumbar spine and will free me from pain, once settled down. I hope so.

Thanks,

Paul

[PGBrew]

Paul,

I do hope that you op goes well and that you will recover enough to be able to move around pain free. As far as getting someone to help you out through this difficult period, just get some to help you out on a voluntary basis. You then don't have to worry about their employment status.

Regards,

Pete

[Rossi fan]

Hi Pete,

Thanks. The cosultant is fairly confident that it will work- time will tell I suppose.

I cant do that as I will be risking too much. I am not the sort to take unneccessary risks, but my insurer Simply Business has said that if I dont have employer liability for anyone helping me, then I am taking a big risk. If the person falls and breaks a leg, or has any injury, they can sue me. Also, my public liability insurance is void if I take someone on without taking out employer liability. Even a relative could sue me if they got hurt, which is unlikely, but not impossible- how crazy things have become. Anyone doing this is taking a risk if something goes pear shaped.

I may have found someone today through an agency, but it will cost £11 per hour. I will double up on busy sites, if they say yes and then I will only need to employ him for two weeks, if I refill them every 4 weeks.

If I dont have a plan, then the only other option is to sell and that is not as easy as it may seem.

Thanks,

Paul

[Coin Operated Group]

Hi Pete,

Thanks. The cosultant is fairly confident that it will work- time will tell I suppose.

I cant do that as I will be risking too much. I am not the sort to take unneccessary risks, but my insurer Simply Business has said that if I dont have employer liability for anyone helping me, then I am taking a big risk. If the person falls and breaks a leg, or has any injury, they can sue me. Also, my public liability insurance is void if I take someone on without taking out employer liability. Even a relative could sue me if they got hurt, which is unlikely, but not impossible- how crazy things have become. Anyone doing this is taking a risk if something goes pear shaped.

I may have found someone today through an agency, but it will cost £11 per hour. I will double up on busy sites, if they say yes and then I will only need to employ him for two weeks, if I refill them every 4 weeks.

If I dont have a plan, then the only other option is to sell and that is not as easy as it may seem.

Thanks,

Paul

Could you not find a fellow operator and give them a % for running the business?